Idea System Broken?

[mwade]

I would like to propose that the Canvas Idea system for feature requests is broken.

There are 321 items that have been voted over 100 by canvas admins and are in the "no man's land" called "product radar." There are only 120 items that have made it into Canvas. That's only 1 in 4 requests that have actually seen the light of day.

Here are some observations:

• Many ideas get lots of votes only to get shelved as not important by the development team. It makes one ask why they bothered to go through all the work to not be taken seriously? It feels more like a scam to make us feel like we are being listened to when in fact there is little change of the idea seeing the light of day.
• If traffic is low during this time of year and an idea will likely not get 100 votes for that reason, it's broken. This sets an impossible standard to achieve. This is the second time we've faced this with an idea? Again, why bother if there is little chance of the idea seeing the light of day. Sadly, simply lowering the threshold will not improve the likelihood that an feature request will make it to production.

It leaves me wondering, does Instructure really listen or is this system just a bunch of red tape to tie things up and make it difficult to get issues fixed or improved? - Canvas team, please don't get defensive on this. I'm sure your intentions are pure, but the realities on our end may be providing a different result than your intentions.

Again, I propose that the entire idea/feature request system is broken. If there really are limited resources for development, Instructure needs a better way process their customer suggestions.

canvas idea feature idea #feature ideas

[kmeeusen]

Hi  @mwade  

Actually, the Community Managers just finished a complete overhaul of the Feature Idea process, and you can learn more at Changes are here: New feature idea processes went live Friday! (2/24/17) 

It leaves me wondering, does Instructure really listen or is this system just a bunch of red tape to tie things up and make it difficult to get issues fixed or improved?

This leads to what I really want to tell you about, Project Khaki 2017 that 40 of us from the Community were very pleased to have participate in last week. Essentially, 40 Community members that had a nice mix of K12, HE, Admins, Faculty and Instructional Designers were flown to Salt Lake City to decide how apx. 1/10th of Instructure's product development budget would be spent, and what it would be spent on. Working from 50 top-voted feature ideas, we weaned this list down to 12 projects that would be developed over the next 6 - 18 months. We sat down with Instructure Engineers and members of the product team to hash things out. This was a considerable expense by Instructure to do exactly what it says it does - place the users first!

Also, you said,

If traffic is low during this time of year and an idea will likely not get 100 votes for that reason, it's broken. 

With more than 160,000 members in the Canvas Community, there hardly seems a time when traffic is low. Yes, there are times when it is "lower" (Summer), but that is only relative to the normal volumes, and still quite high.

Finally..............

There are 321 items that have been voted over 100 by canvas admins and are in the "no man's land" called "product radar." There are only 120 items that have made it into Canvas. That's only 1 in 4 requests that have actually seen the light of day.

I personally have used 4 different LMSs in my career, and none of them let me request features in any organized manner, and "1 in 4" would have been a delusional pipe dream if we did ask for something.

Check out the new Feature Idea process, and I think you will be pleased with how it is now organized around themes that better reflect the Canvas process development priorities, how much more direct the Product Development Team's participation and feedback is, and how much better Community members are able to track and participate in the process of making feature ideas a reality.

Kelley

[James]

 @kmeeusen 

I believe it was billed as 20%, but it was am ambiguous statement, so it might work out to be 10%. It was "20% of our Canvas engineering capacity we've allocated to your priorities for the next 6 months." The absence of "that" before "we've" might make it read as 20% of what we've dedicated to your priorities gets picked by you (so, if they've decided to dedicate 5% of the engineering to our priorities, then it would be 1% of the overall capacity). If, on the other hand, it was typical human-speak where we don't say all of the words and the "that" was just left off but implied, then it could have meant that they've dedicated 20% of their engineering to our priorities.

Either way, it's a big deal with a substantial amount of money thrown into the day and the process.

[scottdennis]

Hey  @James ,

Just to clarify; 20% of the total Canvas engineering budget will be dedicated to the features chosen as part of Khaki, work to be completed over the course of 12 calendar months.

SD

[James]

Thanks for providing the definitive answer,  @scottdennis 

[kmeeusen]

Thanks, Scott!

[dhulsey]

So,  @kmeeusen ‌, can you share what features Khaki 2017 chose to make reality? If it has been posted here on the community, I missed it.  

I am hoping some communications features made it on the list.  

[James]

 @dhulsey ,

Some items weren't even up for consideration because Canvas had already decided to take them on as part of their 80%. I scribbled down their product plan, but I don't see communication on that list either. Based on things I heard, I concluded (I might have read the tea leaves wrong) that communications is one of those areas where they're examining the broader scope and tweaks to the existing system are not a high priority.

[dhulsey]

Yes. That is why I asked specifically about communications. I would like to see some changes, but communications does not seem to be on the front burner. I was glad to see the performance text item in the release notes though. That intrigues me.

So, how about a scan and upload of that scribbled product plan,  @James ?  

[James]

Unfortunately, it's mostly illegible and incomplete (hastily scratched down while paying attention to what was being said). I saw other people taking photos with their phone. Part of it is laid out in their https://community.canvaslms.com/community/ideas  page and I think seeing the whole thing without hearing the explanation that went with it would create more questions (and potentially false hope). It was pointed out that this was a plan, but that they could only reliably see a little bit into the future and that things 6-12 or 12-18 months out might look different by the time we get there.

[dhulsey]

Ok. That's fair. Thanks!

[Jeff_F]

 @dhulsey ‌ - it didn't say 'Proprietary and Confidential', so here it is...

Note the chart is not entirely filled in so as to ensure time and resources are available to respond to customer needs.  I.e. via Khaki, the Community board, etc.

ps. Obscured on the lower left are the words LONG TERM 12 - 18 mo

[laurakgibbs]

Thank you,  @Jeff_F ‌

And I heard from  @Renee_Carney ‌ that a Khaki-related space for discussions and updates is on its way and should be here soon.

Also, I'm pinging  @kona ‌ because I knew I had seen a reference to Mahara somewhere recently, and here it is; looks like Canvas is actively working on that LTI because of its popularity in international community.

[bdalton_sales]

Laura 

Instructure is not working on the Mahara LTI, Instructure is funding our Partner Catalyst to do the LTI development. I'm not sure of its current status but last indications are it has progressed well. 

LTI integration for Mahara | Catalyst AU   

[laurakgibbs]

Oh, that is very nice to know! I didn't even know what international market it was connected too; all I knew what was I saw there on the slide that was shared at the meeting. Thanks for the update!

[925024864]

Cool... this feels a little like WikiLeaks!   LOL

[Jeff_F]

Glad to participate!  [So long as we don't have to move and hide out in the Ecuadorian embassy in London....   ;o)]

[dhulsey]

Thanks,  @Jeff_F ‌! That is awesome. As I look back on the first khaki in 2015, I do not think I ever did a good job of sharing that experience with people in the community. I should have done a better job about that,  and I think it is helpful to hear what happened for this year's participants.

I am curious about "plagiarism framework" in platform evolution. That is intriguing.  

[laurakgibbs]

Hi  @dhulsey ‌! It was something that Mitch talked about, and others will remember the details better (I don't use plagiarism detection software), but it did involve other plagiarism detection services in addition to TurnItIn. Perhaps someone who is there who follows the plagiarism detection world can fill in the details!

[tdelillo]

They said they are working with the major plagiarism-detection vendors on better/deeper integrations (my hopeful interpretation, not exact words). Hopefully it means Turnitin will reverse their API-killing plans, and I know the other vendors were working TOWARD adding an API in addition to LTI, so I've got my fingers crossed for good developments in this area.

[James]

To supplement what  @tdelillo ‌ wrote:

I'm going from memory as well, but there were four vendors that they named off that they were working with to perform a deeper level of integration than what was possible with LTI. This was going to be partially facilitated by the use of webhooks, which is used as a callback or notification system. The example given was, I believe, so Canvas could be notified when a student turns something in on some site.

I don't think webhooks was limited to plagiarism sites, though. Somewhere in that section of notes between plagiarism and webhooks I have written down that it was currently at the proof of concept stage. Developers often start there before expending a lot of energy and resources to make sure that something can be done.

I found it slightly interesting because I'm used to seeing the proof of concept term from security vulnerability releases where someone has shown that it might be possible to hack or break something. Obviously, it would be best if the details were kept secret from the masses in those cases, but I don't think that's where Canvas was headed -- just that they've done some exploration to see if it's even possible and it looks like it might be. There's a long way between proof of concept and delivery of product.

[rlbrown21]

I hope in the "gradebook evolution" we see extra credit as a "checkbox" for each item

[kmeeusen]

Hi  @dhulsey 

At the end of Khaki, we were told that we no longer needed to be secretive, so...................................

Priorities: In order of vote Spreadsheet Version	Running Sprint Total
1. Admin Role Granular Permissions I & II Estimated Sprints: 6 I. As and admin, I need to be able to easily understand how permissions interact, so that I can grant the appropriate permissions for my users. Related Conversation: Canvas Permissions and Granularity Feature Ideas  II. As an admin, I must be able to grant permissions for certain tasks independent of whether a user has other permissions set.                                                                                                                                                                            Related Idea: More granular permissions for admins	6
2. Canvas Content Duplication Estimated Sprints: 6 As an instructor, I want to be able to copy or replicate any content item (assignment, page, discussion, etc.) in my course with one click, preferably from Modules. Related Idea: Duplicate, Clone, or Copy anything in Canvas	12
3. Student Crocodoc Feedback View Estimated Sprints: 4 As a student, finding annotated feedback from my instructor is difficult. I have to view the submission details from the assignment or Grades page, then click a tiny link called View Feedback. The annotated document displays in a tiny window that is difficult to navigate, and downloading the document to review my instructor's comments is difficult as well, since annotations don't show up unless I know how to enable comments in the Print screen. Related Idea: Improve Student Crocdoc Comment View/Accessibility	16
4. Advanced Reports Estimated Sprints: 20 As an admin or instructor, I would like to be able to get more reports from Canvas. Canvas Data is awesome, but it requires advanced knowledge that I do not have and/or additional tools that I cannot afford. Related Idea: More built in reports for Canvas Admin's	36
5. Large Course: Sections/Groups Estimated Sprints: 8 As an instructor, I need different capabilities for creating and managing sections and groups for large courses. Related Idea: None	44
6. Page View Mobile Activity Estimated Sprints: 4 As an instructor, I would like to be able to tell if my students are participating in my course through a mobile device. Related Idea: include Mobile App Page Views in Page Views on User Account Details Page	48
7. Rich Content Editor: File/Image Drag & Drop Estimated Sprints: 6 As a student or instructor, I want to drag and drop files and images from my desktop into the Rich Content Editor (such as in a discussion reply, or assignments) instead of having to upload first. (*image upload is not possible in discussion replies). Related Idea: Drag and drop files into course modules and assignment edit windows & Upload an image directly to a discussion as a student	54
8. Canvas Course Global Search Estimated Sprints: 12 As a student or instructor, I would like to have a global search function in Canvas that would allow me to search for files and content across all my courses. Related Idea: Comprehensive Course Search Tool (Searching Course Content for a Topic)	66
9. Commons: Preview Activities and Content Estimated Sprints: 12 As an instructor or designer, I want to see what a Commons activity or object looks like before I import it into my course so I can avoid wasting time importing, evaluating, and deleting. Related Idea:  Canvas Commons Preview	78
10. Mobile: Camera Access for Embedded Images Estimated Sprints: 3 As a student, I have access to my camera to record a video in the Rich Content Editor, but do not have the same ability to take a picture and embed it directly. Related Idea: Give Access to Camera to Embed Pictures	81
11. Course Archive Process Estimated Sprints: 2 As an admin, I need to manage the myriad of courses in my account and archive ones that are no longer being used. Related Idea: Course Archive Process	83
12. SpeedGrader Screen Recorder Estimated Sprints: 5 As an instructor, I want to provide video feedback showing the student's submission instead of my face. Related Idea: Screen Capture with Audio as a Comment Option	88
13. Large Course: Grading Estimated Sprints: 30 As an instructor, I need a completely different gradebook for large courses. Related Idea: None	118
14. Roles/Permissions Masquerade Estimated Sprints:  Related Idea:
15. Elementary UX Estimated Sprints:  Related Idea: Create template pages

 I hope this helps,

Kelley

[dhulsey]

Thank you, good sir! I appreciate your openness and willingness to share.

[kmeeusen]

Hi  @dhulsey 

It's not my openness that matters; but rather, Instructure's!

I have seldom had the pleasure of a company this open. But you know that.

Kelley

[mjennings]

There is also this version... Khaki 2017 Feature Idea Priorities - Google Sheets  

[kona]

Yeah!! A couple of my personal really really wants are on this list!!

[925024864]

This is awesome Kelley... thanks for posting this! It gives insight into Instructures' process, and redoubles my faith in Instructure and Canvas, which was, and still is, the best LMS of the three that I have personally been involved with, and the six that I have reviewed during RFP processes.

For Instructure with a software program/platform as complex and broadly used as Canvas to be so open and responsive to its users requests and ideas, is a testament to just how user driven Instructure is... and this doesn't even address their prompt and responsive support portal and staff!

[johnmartin]

Drat! I was really hoping that they'd address the terribly broken Google Apps LTI, but maybe they have another development line for fixing badly designed fixes...

I like that Canvas talks a great talk, but they sure make some bone-headed mistakes (as we all do), but take forever to fix them .

[llane2]

Thank you! It's helpful to know what not to have to get angry about. 🙂

[lmorrow1]

Deactivated user pmillar‌ - It would be nice if Australia were offered something like Project Khaki 2017. I have to say it is a little frustrating having ideas and requests that seem to go no-where, and to not be offered the opportunity to contribute towards the road maps and future development of Canvas.

[laurakgibbs]

Just to chime in that while I'm not on a different continent from Instructure, I might as well be: call it Adjunctlandia. As an adjunct, I don't have any travel monies from my school, no funding to go to InstructureCon, etc., but I feel so fortunate that we can all participate here in the Community. In that sense, we are all being given an opportunity to contribute towards the road map and future development of the software. And, even more importantly, to the CULTURE of how people are using the software.

As I understand it, all the proposals on the table at Project Khaki started here in Community discussions. So, I would just urge everybody to keep on posting... changes to the Canvas software are never going to happen quickly, and it's hard to find that balance between personal preferences versus universal appeal, but we can indeed all have our say here at the Community, and it's an opportunity I plan on making the most of. 🙂

[925024864]

Laura, you are absolute correct that "we can all participate here in the Community. In that sense, we are all being given an opportunity to contribute towards the road map and future development of the software. And, even more importantly, to the CULTURE of how people are using the software.".

This is one of the many things that set Instructures' Canvas apart from the other LMS's. And as far as InstructureCon goes, it is a great (and FUN!) event, and full of real value. It really is too bad that some of those who want to go can't attend, but another beauty of Instructure is that almost all sessions, and many of the peripheral events, are posted here in the community afterwards. So, for all Canvas users, both near and far, full-timers and part-timers, this Canvas Community is the place to be!    ;>)

[laurakgibbs]

I'm not even going, but I'm excited for just that reason. I am sure there will be a lot of fun and useful things happening here online that will reflect what is happening at InstructureCon, plus I hope a lot of people who get excited about that f2f opportunity will then come here to connect and explore. The more, the merrier! 🙂

[tdelillo]

 @mwade  - I have also had these moments of frustration over the last 5 years, watching feature ideas that seemed (a) important, and (b) simple get pushed into the archives. But a whole lot of them have actually come to fruition!

I second  @kmeeusen 's remark about other LMSs not even giving us a forum or a voice, although I only have one to compare Canvas to. I have also come to understand and appreciate how difficult it is for Canvas to prioritize changes and updates. The openness of the Community means a lot of varied voices - K12, Higher Ed, Admins, Faculty, Students, even other vendors - are competing for attention.

Canvas is definitely listening. In fact, I think that a lot of the ideas that get shelved are viewed just as passionately by Canvas staff as they're viewed by us, but complexity intrudes. I can't tell you how many conversations I've had with Canvas folks at InstructureCon or elsewhere, that end with "I really wish, but this would break that and that and that". Add to that the "If we do this for [niche market], it's going to REALLY mess things up for [other niche market]".

I think the recent changes to the process will equalize things a little better, and make it more apparent what's truly on the radar.

[laurakgibbs]

Hi  @mwade ! I can definitely here where you are coming from, in the sense that the feature request part of the Community is the most confusing, and I find myself gravitating more towards discussions (like the one you started here!). The first feature request I got really involved in was the course card color overlay which seemed like it should be such a simple fix, but it's still ongoing... argh!

https://community.canvaslms.com/ideas/6521-remove-colour-overlay-from-course-cards-that-have-an-imag... 

So, yes, it can be frustrating, but I would also echo what Kelley and Tracey said already. I was at the Khaki event last week that Kelley described, and it was exciting to realize that some projects, including some really difficult requests, were going to move forward because users voted on them. We did get to make those choices... and it was hard to choose; there are so many different ways a tool like Canvas could and even should be developed, and there are so many different user needs! So, yes, some people had also experienced frustration because those ideas had been proposed a year or two years ago, or maybe even longer ago, and hey are just now getting development funding. And some ideas people really wanted did not make the cut. But that whole process was possible only because of ideas people have shared here over the past two years, and that motivates me to keep on sharing here into the future; it couldn't have happened if people had not brought their ideas to the table in the first place.

My school just switched to Canvas after 10 years on D2L, and D2L was never interested in faculty opinions about anything (maybe they were responsive to sysadmin feedback; I don't know about that). Overall I found D2L to be pretty useless for my purposes. So, as a result, I'm an "LMS minimalist." I use very few features, and I rely on the LMS only for things that need to be secure and password-protected, like the Gradebook. For everything else in my courses, I've gotten used to the idea that I need to solve my own problems... after all, I need solutions NOW, not a year from now or two years from now. I'm not very patient in general, especially when it comes to something important for my students.

With Canvas, though, I am more hopeful: unlike D2L, I really think Canvas really does care about my user experience as a faculty member, and about my students' experience with the software. I see that by the existence of this Community and the support that Canvas gives to the Community, like from our great community managers. And here's why I think the feature system is not really broken: every time someone proposes a new feature, it can be the occasion for a really good discussion.

* I learn new things when people ask for new features. My knowledge of Canvas is pretty limited, and I really enjoy seeing the features people request. Because of my minimal use of Canvas, the feature requests help me ramp up my knowledge of what Canvas can and cannot do.

* I love how Community members propose workarounds and hacks that can help people accomplish their goals even if the absence of the requested feature. That is so cool! After all, the feature is not the goal... so if people can share information, not just about the feature they want, but WHY they want it, well, there are often lots of ways to get to that goal, using external tools or finding a weird hack of an existing feature that will work.

* Connecting with other people is powerful. There are some people with really deep knowledge of Canvas who participate here at the Community and, as you get to know them, you'll figure out who will be able to help you up in all kinds of ways. Even though I don't use Canvas extensively, I have gotten help here from Community members that has improved my technical skills especially with web design along with my knowledge of online tools and how to use them both inside and outside of Canvas.

So, I definitely understand your frustration, but I do feel like time spent here at the Community is time well spent. That's why I spend a lot of time here, ha ha: I learn new things every day, and that means I have more to offer to my students, and also more to offer here at the Community.

If there is some specific obstacle you are facing in your use of Canvas, definitely start up a discussion about that and see if the collective wisdom has anything to offer. Even if Canvas doesn't have the feature you are looking for, maybe there is a good way to work around that, so that you can at least get the job done. I sometimes call myself the "Queen of Kludge" because I've been teaching online since 2002, back when there were way fewer tools than there are now, but somehow it was also possible to make the learning happen. Anyway, I'm always willing to try to brainstorm a solution to any teaching problem. Sometimes you even find a solution that works better than the feature you were looking for to begin with. 

P.S. If I were to suggest one way to improve the Feature Request process, I guess I would require everybody to do a discussion FIRST in order to refine their idea... and then move it on to Feature Request after a really good discussion. The discussion is the really valuable part IMO, and it's better to have the discussion take place IN a Discussion space since Feature Requests do get shunted off into Cold Storage eventually, but Discussions remain available for people to return to and consult whenever they want in the future.

[mjennings]

laurakgibbs wrote:

P.S. If I were to suggest one way to improve the Feature Request process, I guess I would require everybody to do a discussion FIRST in order to refine their idea... and then move it on to Feature Request after a really good discussion. The discussion is the really valuable part IMO, and it's better to have the discussion take place IN a Discussion space since Feature Requests do get shunted off into Cold Storage eventually, but Discussions remain available for people to return to and consult whenever they want in the future.

I think this is a brilliant idea. I have seen several feature ideas that had very minimal information regard the specifics of what is wanted. I know that the Canvas folks are good about pointing to the guide for how to write a good feature request, but it seems that many do not fully flesh out their idea.

It could be very beneficial if there was a better way to engage the community into a discussion to flesh out the ideas prior to submitting it for a voting period.

[laurakgibbs]

Thank you,  @mjennings ‌! And yes, I see that sometimes too, kind of "drive-by feature requests" where people will put up a feature request without really developing it or getting feedback from others first. Given the huge range of Canvas users and the different ways that they use Canvas, getting feedback from others is almost certain to improve any feature request.

Doing the feature request sometimes seems like putting the cart before the horse: it's better to define the PROBLEM first (the vocabulary they used at Khaki was all about "user stories" and "pain points"), and then go about thinking what kind of Canvas feature might help solve that problem.

I think that vocabulary of user stories and pain points comes from Agile development which they use at Instructure...? I'm more familiar with Design Thinking approaches, and there seems to be a lot of overlap between Agile and Design Thinking. I found this helpful article at Medium:

How to combine Design Thinking and Agile in practice

https://medium.com/startup-study-group/

[tdelillo]

I love the phrase "drive-by feature requests"! My coworker  @kschneider25 ‌ and I were just talking about your idea to have the discussion first, formal feature idea second. She noted that such discussions could get a little... well, wild and possibly contentious. Which I said could be a good thing. But the tough part would be deciding, after all that discussion, what the exact idea is. And who would be the person responsible for ending the discussion and pulling out the core idea. The Community team? The originator of the discussion? I'm just playing devil's advocate here, I truly think this would be an exciting approach...

[laurakgibbs]

Let me ping  @Renee_Carney  here because I think she is a community manager who is definitely involved in trying to make the Feature Requests run smoothly, looking for duplicates, seeking clarification, etc. What do you think about this, Renee?

I'm also wondering if it might be helpful to gather up some of these Agile and Design Thinking resources so that we could all try to learn more about the design process in order to clarify our own thinking. The Agile stuff is totally new to me, and it's definitely the language that Instructure engineers are speaking!

I have seen some really great use of Design Thinking by instructional designers like the awesome Bucky Dodd, whose online ILED workshops I attended last summer and found really helpful in tinkering with my classes, so time that we spend thinking about Design Thinking would probably benefit us in lots of ways. 🙂