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In Permissions, Separate "Manage (create/edit /delete) groups" into 3 permissions

In Permissions, Separate "Manage (create/edit /delete) groups" into 3 permissions

This idea has been developed and deployed to Canvas

For more information, please read through the  Canvas Release Notes (2021-09-18)


Please change each the "Manage (create / edit / delete) groups" from a single setting to three separate settings.

 

Current:

Manage (create / edit / delete) groups

 

 

Should become:

  • Create groups
  • Edit groups
  • Delete groups

 

One reason for this request:

This would allow you to set TAs (or other roles) to having only the permissions needed for that role instead of none of them or all of them. For example, the ability to edit groups but not add and delete groups.

19 Comments
buellj
Community Contributor

A huge thank you cms_hickss​ for adding all of these as separate requests.

admin_brake
Community Participant

In some of our large enrollment courses, groups are managed by different roles. Having these as separate permissions enables a better level of security and efficiency.

elisabeth_green
Community Participant

Especially important in classes that allow students to form their own groups but need some instructor management...

allison
Instructure
Instructure

Thanks for sharing this idea. I think it's something definitely worth considering, though we would need to look closely at how many users would actually benefit from this change relative to other permissions change requests. This request may fall below some of the other requests that could have a wider impact. While I'm doing some digging on my side related to usage (groups, TAs, large courses), can you share with me all the juicy details about exactly how this change would benefit your workflow?

Here are some prompts to get you started:

- What types of large courses? Survey courses?

- How often do TAs need to add students to groups when groups are used this way?

- What kinds of improved security would result from this change?

- What kinds of improved efficiency would result from this change?

- Of the three unbundled permissions, which is most important for the TA to have?

Thanks for your continued interest in improving Canvas.

cms_hickss
Community Contributor

I am starting o sound like a broken record, but again, because DELETE is bundled into the permission, this permission is turned off for TAs. I should note, that in our previous LMS our TAs had more access than they do now.

Since TAs cannot create groups, they don't use this function. Since EDIT is lumped in there TAs cannot EDIT a group.

We have teachers who would like to give the EDIT and CREATE options to their TAs (especially in large classes) but cannot as they do not want the TA to be able to DELETE.

admin_brake
Community Participant

I agree - it the DELETE permissions that are the show-stopper in a bundle of permissions.

Melody Brake - Colorado State University

kona
Community Coach
Community Coach

Yep, it's the delete issue that's the problem for us as well!

BROEKERC
Community Participant

Rationale: this functionality is needed to allow TAs to edit groups but not delete.  The problem is the bundling of permissions. We use groups in many courses such as Nursing, English and Business and adding/editing groups happens each semester.  The efficiency that would result in this change is that it would make it easier for TAs and faculty in team taught courses to make the updates. 

RE: Of the three unbundled permissions, which is most important for the TA to have? DELETE needs to be unbundled. 

cdoherty
Community Participant

Rationale for Stanford: To prevent accidental deletions.

allison
Instructure
Instructure

Thanks, everyone for your comments. This is an idea I will archive for now. But the big takeaway here is that the DELETE permission should generally exist apart from the CREATE and EDIT permissions. Lesson learned and we'll see how we might apply that principle going forward.

millerjm
Community Champion

We need some support for our case that the permissions available in Canvas are not sufficient for our needs.  Above is the update that Allison Weiss posted to many of our feature ideas.  She is asking for use cases for granularity and we really need to justify each and every one.  I made a document to track discussions and feature ideas related to permissions: 

Canvas Permissions and Granularity Feature Ideas

This is the sort of information that would assist in getting these changes made during this permissions audit.  This information would need to be added as comments to the individual feature ideas, and if it needs to be pasted to more than one, then please do that.  I know it's tiresome to post the same thing again and again, even though someone else has already done it, but they need to see that it's not just 5 people with these issues!  We haven't gotten much traction because we haven't had enough use cases posted but my document above seems to have gotten some attention.

  • What has the current user permissions "bundling" and lack of granularity cost you in terms of support and functionality?
  • What permissions have you HAD to grant to someone simply to allow them to be able to do their job, that you would have rather NOT given?
  • What permissions have you had to DENY giving someone because it gave them access to something that you could not due to security, concern about causing trouble, etc.?
  • What other qualms do you have about things?
  • What things have cost you more in staff hours because of denying access to someone, means that your department had to research, do work, etc, on behalf of a user that would have been able to do their work if the permissions were granular?

Thank you!

Joni

I'm also tagging  @kona ​ and cms_hickss​  since they have been so involved in getting attention to these feature ideas. 

Renee_Carney
Community Team
Community Team
  Idea is currently in Product Radar Learn more about this stage...
cms_hickss
Community Contributor

Can I have a WOOHOO!!!!  🙂

victoria-maloy
Community Champion

cms_hickss WOOHOO!!!!

Renee_Carney
Community Team
Community Team

The Radar idea stage has been removed from the Feature Idea Process.  You can read more about why in the blog post Adaptation: Feature Idea Process Changes.

 

This change will only impact the stage sort of this idea and will not change how it is voted on or how it is considered during prioritization activities.  This change will streamline the list of ideas 'open for voting', making it easier for you to see the true top voted ideas in one sort, here.

cms_hickss
Community Contributor

For this idea, please remember to follow:

The first step to getting Granular Permissions was completed with the Permissions: New Interface.

Stefanie
Community Team
Community Team
Status changed to: On Beta
 
Stefanie
Community Team
Community Team
Comments from Instructure

The Groups - add / edit / delete permission has been grouped into three separate permissions. This change provides granularity in managing courses. (This update does not affect Canvas APIs.)

For more information, please read through the  Canvas Release Notes (2021-09-18)

Stefanie
Community Team
Community Team
Status changed to: Completed