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lhenson
Explorer II

Cross-list courses

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I have a teacher who wants to cross-list her sections, but she already has content in them. If I unpublish the courses which are moving into the main course, will that retain the content when they are republished?  

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lhenson
Explorer II

I just ran a test in the beta site and here is the conclusion I reached.  When I cross-listed ChildDev-07 with ChildDev-02 (the parent course) it wiped out all of the grades, submissions and assignments for ChildDev-07.  ChildDev-02 stayed in tact.  I can download the grades from ChildDev-07 prior to cross-listing it, but any submissions will be lost.  

Thanks for all the help and the beta suggestion.  That gave me a playground to test some things out - I need to remember that for next time.

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kona
Community Coach
Community Coach

No, I don't believe they will because they loose their individual identity. So they couldn't be individually published or unpublished if they were crosslisted. When crosslisted the multiple courses become one course, but have different sections within the course that represent the original cross listed courses. 

Does this make sense?

It does make sense.  Just want to clarify before I do this.  So, I can unpublish the separate courses (sections), cross-list them and any assignments/quizzes assigned to students in those courses (sections) should be in tact? 

Here is what the Canvas help has on their instructions, which is why I wanted to double check:  Cross-listing should be done while courses are unpublished. Coursework is retained with the course, not with the section enrollments, so if a published course is cross-listed, all cross-listed enrollments will lose any associated assignment submissions and grades.

kona
Community Coach
Community Coach

I'll be honest that I'm not an expert with cross-listing. We don't use it at our Institution (we do all combining of course on the back end of Canvas). 

From my limited knowledge, the unpublishing part is only because you shouldn't cross list courses after they've already been published and have students working in them. The reason for this is that you will lose all of their work and what they did in the course that gets cross-listed into the other course. In addition, if you have students already in the course working in them then you can't unpublish them. 

I'm going to share this with the https://community.canvaslms.com/groups/admins?sr=search&searchId=eab32519-b8bb-4c34-b592-c7c2c179653...‌ group in the Community to see if you can get some help from people who actually use this tool!

kbickell
Community Member

Cross-listing courses after faculty have created content should not be too problematic. But if students have done any work then typically it gets hidden in the cross-list. If that's not the case here, one less mess to deal with.  

kblack
Community Member

Leslie, Kona is absolutely correct on this. (Not surprisingly! Smiley Happy )  I had one real experience with this, and my first recommendation is if enough time has passed in your term, you may want to try this out first on your Beta installation if you can, since that is refreshed every weekend.  With luck, your class in question might have some material in it.  But as Kona stated, it is the student work that will be lost.  Here was my scenario (course names made up, of course!):

Hist 100 was published, as was Hist 101.  Hist 101 already had some student discussion posts in it, but not Hist 100.  But it was Hist 101 that was to be cross-listed INTO Hist 100.  (So Hist 100 was the "parent" course site, "absorbing" Hist 101.)  All student discussions in Hist 101 were lost once the cross-listing occurred.  To be honest, I cannot remember what happened with the content in the course, but I believe (as you saw in the documentation) that the content survived unscathed.  (Certainly in the parent Hist 100 course; not 100% certain with the Hist 101 course.)

If it's only course content that is there and NOT student assignments/contributions/whatever, you should be okay.  In fact, if it IS only content that is there, I recommend--to be safe--that you export both sites and import them into Beta and then try your cross listing in Beta.

Thanks so much for the further explanation. Yes, Kona is always correct with her responses, but this one was a big deal if it got messed up. Didn't even think about trying it in Beta first to see what actually happens. Let me look further into the course to make sure that the courses being cross-listed don't have any student submissions and only content.

Thanks again you all. I can always count on the Community to answer my questions.

lhenson
Explorer II

I just looked at the courses which I am planning on cross-listing into a Parent Course and found that there are grades in them already, which means that there are student submissions in them.  So, if I cross-list these courses into the parent course, the grades will be lost, correct?  I looked in the beta version and there aren't any grades, content, assignments, etc in the courses.  She must have put them all in this week after it reset.  Not really a way to test this until next week when it picks up the new info. 

kbickell
Community Member

The grades won't actually be "lost" permanently, just hidden by the cross-listing. Which for the professor means the same thing, but they can be retrieved by de-cross-listing. So the grades can be downloaded before cross-listing and entered manually, but the professor will have no way of seeing the work or any attachments. 

Always best to cross-list before any work or content is done, but a message we're still trying to get across to our institution Smiley Happy

kona
Community Coach
Community Coach

Since it's in Beta you could add grades into the course or even go in as a student and upload something and then cross list it to test it out. Anything you add won't show up to the teacher or students, so you're fine doing this. I actually do it myself time to time when I need to test something.

Also, if it's just grades and not student submissions you could download the gradebook from the course and then after the cross-listing re-add them into the cross-listed course.