New Discussions is awful. Please revert to the old format

[NigelCaplan]

Dear Canvas, please roll back the enforcement of New Discussions. The format is virtually unusable. I can't find new posts, I have to make multiple clicks to do basic functions, and the default view discourages discussion by hiding replies. This makes your product worse. Get rid of it, or at least give users the choice.

[amanda_mueller]

100% agree! And why can't we just click the red circle to check off a post we've read? We have to intuit that we have to go to the three dots now? I had to go to Canvas support to learn how to use that. Seems like a step back, not forward. 

[mmoore1]

I like the Announcement Discussions Redesign.  Have you tried searching for keywords?  Using the Split Screen?  Expanding Threads?  It seems more user friendly to me and a user can find someone with similar interests when the posts get boring and static.  

[cheryltice]

The problem is that it might be intuitive but because of the extra clicks, students are not clicking into it and having deeper conversations like they'd had in the legacy discussions tool. I see that as a huge issue.

[kirsten_naughto]

Threads don't seem to stay expanded and clicking the Split Screen causes expanded threads to close. It takes several extra click to do what was one click or already open before. It might work for Announcements, but in Discussions it is not as user friendly. It is not an intuitive change when considering what the students are familiar with.

[LillianMarrujo]

Nigel,

I agree, there are some features of the New Discussions that are problematic. I did find the "expand" button so that I did not have to click on all the replies. BUT, the shrinking font in the replies is a real visibility issue. Also, the greyed-out background in the speed grader is going to create wear and tear on our eyes and brain as we spend hours grading. This background needs to be reverted to white. 

[LillianMarrujo]

I want to add to my own complaint: I really need the order of the discussions to be organized by the date and time of the original post - not rearranged each time someone replies. As I work with the discussions this summer, I just have no expedient way of tracking my own replies to students to provide equity and balance. I just do not have time to keep searching through and see what I missed because an original post is hidden between others that have been replied to. 

[NAshcraft]

I agree.  I also systematically read through (and reply to) the posts in the order in which they have been submitted.  When the order constantly changes, it makes my work more difficult and time consuming.  I would like to have a setting where I can "fix" or freeze the order of the posts.

[SueTaylor]

I also agree - it's very difficult to work with.

[cheryltice]

I've been advocating for this, as well- chronological order by post and default expanded view.

[astaley]

I, too, am finding it difficult to track my replies as well. The old format allowed me to see clearly how active the threads were. I could also search for all of my posts a lot easier with the old format than with the new one. It seems like it will find some of my posts but not all of them.

[LillianMarrujo]

I am adding again to my complaint as I use the new discussions over the summer. I want all of my students to be responded to by other students. When discussions rearranges the order of the posts by the latest response, it makes it extra effort to find those original posts that have not been responded to yet. This would be less of a problem if the software was not also slow. Somehow, however the program was written, it seems to be bloated (too much code!). Trying to just scroll down smoothly does not work. It pauses and then jumps and I have to back up to see which original post I am now looking at. This is a drag on the time and effort of both students and faculty. This is not an improvement over the old discussions. 

[lshulman]

When I have a webpage slow to respond like that, I just assume it is an issue with my computer being bogged down.

[OnlineFaculty2]

It is the code--a very poor design.

[LillianMarrujo]

I am continuing to log issues as I work with new discussions. The search feature does not work. I need to be able to search the discussion - I am usually searching on a student's name to follow up with something they wrote. No matter how many times I click on the up or down arrow, the screen is not moving to the next instance of that student's name. I do not have time to negotiate all the quirks in this new system. Discussions is the main arena where I am in conversation with my students - this is where I exercise my discipline expertise and probe students' thinking. I need to be able to use it effortlessly. Also, please, once I am signed in, could I not have the "human-check" that goes on and on with images to click on. This is just too much. 

[lshulman]

I too found that the search feature does not work. I like to use my browser's search (control+F). That just did not highlight nor jump to each instance of what I was searching for. Just takes me to the first instance. Though it does tell me how many total there are, I can't find the others.

[astaley]

Exactly!! The search feature does not work!!! Like you, I use the search feature to follow up on certain discussion threads and students. I also use it to track my own participation in the discussions.

[amanda_mueller]

Have also discovered that you have to constantly re-expand the threads if you reply to something, or refresh, or sneeze... And the shrinking text seems like a potential accessibility issue. Seriously how is this an improvement? I don't think I've ever felt the need to visit a discussion forum and complain so insistently, but this update is especially terrible. 

[kirsten_naughto]

Yes! I have experienced this over and over!

[gregtew]

Agree, the last thing I want to do with my time is post to these forums, but the loss of the Sort by Likes tool is a disaster for my use of discussions in a online class with more than a 1,000 students. Now every post is equal, and they are not, I need the cream to rise to the top.

[OnlineFaculty2]

A number of other faculty have complained and we are going to have a D2L rep come out to show Brightspace as an option an an alternative LMS.

[SueTaylor]

Be careful what you wish for with D2L. I teach at two institutions. One uses Canvas and the other Brightspace D2L. I hate the new discussion format in Canvas but there are a lot more things I don't like in Brightspace. (many of us have shortened it to BS) Be sure you look at it carefully and ask for time for hands on trials. Look especially at grading and the grade book.

[StephanieMeredi]

I want students to read MY replies to students' posts. They are not going to do that if they have to click on every post to see what kinds of replies are there. This redesign makes discussion boards completely useless for things like brainstorming project design among a group of students and myself, which is a major use of discussion boards for me in my classes. I will have to take this activity outside of Canvas until we have the option to set expanded threads as the default for all users in the class.

[cheryltice]

Yes! Extra clicks = less student interaction.

[gwied]

And so Canvas continues to depend on third party companies to keep adding their OWN bells and whistles just to prop up the inadequacies of basic LMS functions in Canvas. Don't like New Quizzes? Tophat is good for that. Can't grade hand-written work? Gradescope is added. Can't use the new discussions? There's an LTI for that... and for that... and that, too, etc, etc.

[NAshcraft]

My university is piloting the Harmonize discussion tool.  After trying both the new Canvas discussions and Harmonize, my class voted to use Harmonize.  We ended up using that for the rest of the semester.

[gregtew]

I "edit" student posts by highlighting key points in their posts, and I then add my comments in blue. See below. But for me, the loss of the Sort by Likes option means my comments get lost in a sea of posts since my classes are huge with 1,000s of posts to each question I ask. Also, the screencapture from the old design for discussions shows the indented format for replies, that was much better than everything now being inline and replies are only distinguished by a smaller font. A decision clearly made by a young person with strong eyes.

[mangles]

Please forgive me for piggy-backing on your posting. I tried to start a new one, but Canvas would not save it.

My use of Canvas discussions requires my students see and read every posting. Call it a "discussion", just like in a classroom.

Well the new release destroys this. It is that simple. Who ever wrote the spec on this new release does not teach distant education classes. I like some of the features. But what are you thinking when the default enables students to hide from our discussions.

Stupid...

Allow me to repeat myself:

I need my posting replies to each student to be visible to the whole class by default.
They are not.
My written word is how I teach. I add eye-catching gimmicks to postings to gain their attention. Now they won't see 'em.

The written postings of the students and myself is our classroom.
All of them need to be visible by default.

They need to be keyword searchable; this is important to the discussion learning process.
Now the replies are hidden. Students will NOT click on '# Unread'.

PLEASE, please change the default to display all postings as we had before where they are visible, or gives instructors the ability to configure how postings are displayed.

Don't assume. It will make an ass of u and me.

~mike angles, West Valley College

[kbeyer]

Thank you Mike, for articulating the issues so clearly.  This redesign seems built to discourage student participation and engagement.  

I suspect that while there are a lot of tech engineers and experts who worked on this, there is a critical gap in understanding the technology we use to teach, and actually teaching using that technology.  There are so many things in this redesign that make everything harder for instructors and students, and forcing it upon us next month is ridiculous.

I am teaching three summer classes.  I have turned off the redesign and am using the legacy layout for my classes.  But on July 20, that option goes away and everyone will be forced to use the new redesign.  That will happen in the middle of the summer term.  Since we don't have the option to stick with legacy after that date, I will simply cancel all remaining discussion assignments for the remainder of my summer classes.

PLEASE DO NOT FORCE THIS UPON US NEXT MONTH.  LEAVE THE OPTION TO STICK WITH LEGACY OR ADOPT THE NEW REDESIGN UP TO EACH CLASS/INSTRUCTOR!!!

[gcako]

I agree: "PLEASE DO NOT FORCE THIS UPON US NEXT MONTH.  LEAVE THE OPTION TO STICK WITH LEGACY OR ADOPT THE NEW REDESIGN UP TO EACH CLASS/INSTRUCTOR!!!"

[SueTaylor]

I am experiencing all the same issues. The other thing that I've not seen addressed here so far is that the discussion posts are divided into two pages. I don't know how they are divided since it's neither chronologically based on their initial post or alphabetically but it does not appear students are looking at the second page. It took me a while to realize it as I was searching and searching for things I could clearly see in speed grader. Does anyone know if there is a way to change the setting to get them to all appear on one page?

[dspiel]

This has been mentioned SO MANY times but as the new Instructure works... if users need it... want it.. they won't do it sadly.

[gregtew]

Like Mike, I add some viual interest to disussions by getting into students' posts using the edit tool, but now that Sort by Likes is gone, my posts - I am the teacher - get lost in the sea of posts. With my than 1,000 students, discussions run on for 20-30 screens.

 

[jcrozier2]

100% agree - the redesign is awful.  Worse than awful. 

It is NOT user friendly.

The posts do NOT thread and to hide them makes more work for students - who want less work.

There was just an article about students not willing to read and then you go and HIDE under the replies button all the posts.  I want my students to be able to SKIM the whole board and look for specific concepts to help them ... and now you made that include steps to open and read replies.

Also there HAS to be boxes around the posts so we can EASILY see which reply goes to which post.

Whoever redesigned this has not been teaching.

Here is what is good - the tagging is good. 

The side view - although I will not use it but I get how someone might like it.

If you want to put that collapse button in and let the DEFAULT be the expanded view - then do that.

But if I am expanding the board for me - it does not expand it for my students and frankly it does not stay open for me either.  To have to add more clicks is not helpful.

Let me FORCE the expand for students.

And put back the lines around the posts so I can see who is responding.

OH and HOW DARE CANVAS put out a redesign without giving us the ICONS - you changed how to subscribe and you did not provide new images or a new VIDEO.

Never ever put out a redesign without a video we can share. 

Is is not a best practice to not give videos on how to do something to students.  Then we are all taking screenshots and making videos - that is such a time waster.

Poorly executed and poorly rolled out. 

[JenniferBBlack]

I agree that the redesign is terrible! I decided to give it a try for my summer class; it was so unwieldy and hard to navigate that I am in despair about having to use it for all my classes in the future. I miss being able to collapse all the threads down so that I can see just the person's name and a bit of their post! It's so hard to see which posts still need responses or which students haven't posted yet.

PLEASE LET US GO BACK TO THE OLD FORMAT!!

[clpatter]

How likely is it that the forced update WON'T happen on July 20th?

Our new semester starts next week, and to keep things from changing in the middle of the semester, we were planning to update to the new format this weekend. Now, with all the complaints, I'm worried that Canvas will decide to postpone the update after we've switched, and we'll be stuck with this new format.

[lshulman]

I don't think you would be stuck with it. When we had the option to turn "features" on or off, it was as simple as going to course settings to switch back and forth (to try it out). 

But, in some cases, institutional administrators make the decision to not allow instructors this option. My institution forced use of the redesign before we started our summer session in May (so as to avoid change in mid semester).

[JoshuaPatrick]

That is correct, I do not have the option to revert to legacy.

[nicole_fleetwoo]

I'm the lead Canvas admin at my technical college.  I flipped the switch at the end of our spring quarter to avoid a mid-quarter change. If they did decide to back off the current date (please!), I wouldn't continue forcing our faculty to use the redesign. I'd allow them to use whichever discussion format met their needs.

Taking it a step further - if they did decide to change the cutover date significantly, I do think it would be beneficial if Instructure provided folks with the option of using Discussions Redesign or Classic Discussions, just as they did with New Quizzes. When faculty import or build a discussion, they're prompted to choose which version best suits their needs for the discussion at hand. That would also keep them from having to go into course settings to choose which version they want, as not all faculty are comfortable doing that.  

If the option to choose between discussion formats was provided to the admins, I'm sure a lot, if not most, of us would toggle that switch on.  

[clpatter]

I think letting instructors have the option to choose would be a perfect solution.  Then at some point later, when all the planned changes have been added, announce a Classic Discussions end date.